What About Vietnam

What About Vietnam - S3-23 

Vietnam - Your next Wellness destination

Kerry Newsome: 00:35

Xin Chào and welcome to “What About Vietnam Travel Podcast”. One of the questions that comes up quite a bit is, "Is Vietnam a wellness destination?" Now in the past, and I'm talking prior to COVID, this would have been a bit hard for me to answer. As we all know, wellness is many things to many people, and I have covered this off in other shows. However, in the past two years, while the country has been locked away from international tourism, there does seem to be a significant shift to wellness in Vietnam. And my guest today is a good example of someone spearheading that trend.

01:17

Hylton Lipkin is my guest, and he is the general manager for Alba Wellness Valley located in central Vietnam. I was keen to talk to Hylton as he's really passionate about wellness and comes to the show with some real depth of experience in this area. Born in South Africa, he's traveled and lived in many countries around the globe. His career started off as an International Fitness Presenter. And from there he moved to the spa industry. And that ultimately then connected neatly with his entrance into hospitality.

01:53

He is also the World Wellness Weekend Ambassador for Vietnam and is really big on trying to promote wellness and happiness throughout Vietnam and the world. He's a very entertaining guest, and he has some real home truths to share about the growth of this type of travel in Vietnam, and how developers are now directing their attention to better ways to save the environment and bring health and wellness to people during their stays in Vietnam.

I think for people who are looking for a new and interesting wellness destination, one that offers beautiful culture, people, nature, quality food and sustainable practices; designed to preserve the environment. You're going to get a lot out of this show. Please welcome Hylton to the program.

Kerry Newsome: 02:54

Hylton, welcome to the What About Vietnam Podcast, lovely to have you on the show.

Hylton Lipkin: 03:00

It's an honor to be here. Thank you very much.

Kerry Newsome: 03:03

Fabulous! Hylton, when we started to do a deep dive into your history and obviously, your love of Vietnam. I mean, you've lived in many countries around the world. What was it about Vietnam that first captured your heart and keeps you there?

Hylton Lipkin: 03:25

To tell you the real version or the poetic version.

Kerry Newsome: 03:28

[laughter] Whichever you prefer.

Hylton Lipkin: 03:32

I can go into detail about beautiful meandering rice fields and mountains and beautiful conical hats and beautiful scenery in Vietnam. But the reality is I got offered a job. And that's what brought me to Vietnam. Somehow, for some strange reason the jobs that I've had over the couple of postures have been kind of in a straight line. I started off in Thailand, in Asia, actually in India, then kind of went to Thailand, and kind of went to Cambodia, then to Laos, and then to Vietnam.

04:03

So, for some strange reason. It's kind of in a straight line across Asia. But the honest reply is I got offered a job in Vietnam and I took the opportunity, and that's what brought me to Vietnam. And to answer your second question, what keeps me here, is: I love the place. I love my work, but it's still my job. Especially over the last two years. No one is really looking to jump ship and go to a new opportunity. But I love what I do. So, I'm still in Vietnam because I have my job in Vietnam. I enjoy what I do. But I came to Vietnam because I got offered a job. I love the place is beautiful.

Kerry Newsome: 04:40

And you know what better thing in life to have, other than a job that you love, also in a country that you have fallen for. So, I think that's the pièce de résistance. So good for you.

As an international fitness presenter, I'd like to know just a little bit more about that, and maybe how you've applied that knowledge and that background experience, into your job and into your role into in Vietnam.

Hylton Lipkin: 05:17

Yes, I've always been involved in fitness, I've always been very interested in fitness. And I started my fitness career as a presenter when I was living in South Africa, where I was born. And I traveled immensely around the world presenting fitness programs and fitness education programs and working with different associations and groups all over the world. Nothing to do with hospitality, nothing to do with spas. But that was definitely a fantastic grounding and routing towards the fitness industry. Cutting a long story short, I landed up working in Hong Kong a couple of times at a fitness convention, which was mixed with the spa, they call it a spa and wellness convention in Hong Kong. And I kind of got introduced into the spa world from there. Another long story short, I got offered a job by a spa company, you may have heard of them, Mandara Spa, coming out of Asia, and now actually run by the American counterparts, Steiner.

06:24

And, yes, that kind of introduced me to the hospitality and spa industry. So, I worked for them for a couple of years. And that took me to a couple of countries around the world again, and then spa industry, linked to hospitality industry. And then, you know, again, long story short, I became a general manager of a hotel, a couple of hotels. And then of course, with my wellness background. And today, wellness being quite a big, important part of hospitality, it really fits pretty well, at least, I think it fits pretty well. And I know that speaking to investors, or speaking to regional managers, or directors or CEOs, they don't always understand the value of a fitness center, versus a beautiful expensive bottle of wine on the table. And I think there's a big mix coming towards that now. So, I think that I'm not saying, I'm the best, that I'm not saying I'm fantastic. But I think my background in wellness and going through this whole channel that I explained to you can definitely help me see the value of a fitness center versus a very expensive bottle of wine. Don't get me wrong, a beautiful bottle of wine, expensive bottle of wine is great. But the fitness element in terms of hospitality is actually becoming more and more important.

Kerry Newsome: 07:42

Hylton, what I'm keen to explore with you, and I'm sure you've done this in your role, and in talking to many other operators in Vietnam, is: Vietnam hasn't been typically known as a wellness destination. I'm, I'm sitting here in Australia. And over the years, probably Bali would have been the first pick for a wellness destination. But over the few years, the couple of years now that I've been doing the podcast and talking to more people in wellness, I can see a definite shift in the landscape across hotels, I can see a shift in what people are wanting to present within their packages. They wanting to include some elements of that. So, tell us a little bit about how you think Vietnam is shaping up as a wellness destination.

Hylton Lipkin: 08:44

I think first and foremost what you mentioned back there in terms of wellness. And the big question is wellness is different things to different people. It's very important that people first define what they consider to be wellness, either:

· From a traveler’s perspective.

· From an operator's perspective.

· From a government’s perspective, or even obviously, from an operator's perspective.

But yes, 100% people were locked up at home for quite some time, a fair amount of frustration. We won't go into that, because there's a gazillion podcasts out there about COVID and being stuck at home. I think, yes, everyone has woken up to this wellness idea. It's a diverse idea because it has many different aspects towards what it actually is and what it can bring to different people.

But answering your question directly Vietnam; yes, has a very big percentage of gross domestic income from hospitality. We know that and they are every week every month a new area developing, and in Vietnam, they tend to go rather fast. They discover a nice town and a nice beach and before you know it, there's 20 Hotels going up there and then another 20 operators coming in, which has its positives and its negatives. But it's very important for the country. So yes. If we just speak about Vietnam today, there is a waking up towards wellness.

10:13

Now, having a spa treatment and eating salad is wellness, to a certain degree. Is a kind of intensity wellness? Is it something that's going to change people's life? To a certain degree? Yes, if we go back to expensive bottle of wine, you can go to a hotel, anywhere in the country, have an expensive bottle of wine, and eat your red meat or whatever it might be. It's still fantastic. And it's a great experience. Now, if you do R&R, if you're going and switching off a no mobile phone and relaxing and recharging, that's definitely wellness, you're going on holiday to switch off and come back recharged. So that is wellness to a certain degree.

But of course, we tried to go a little bit deeper than that and say, "Okay, well then take away the alcohol, take away the red meat, and actually cleanse yourself, go there and learn how to eat correctly, but at the same time, still do the R&R." So, as I mentioned, it really depends on what level of what people consider to be wellness. So, every property in Vietnam can and is doing wellness. I'll give you a very good example. Yesterday, I was looking through Facebook, and here in Huế, there's a small city hotel, and I see them all the time on Facebook. And they generally do adverts about F&B, or about their cocktails and their dinner. And suddenly there was a picture of a fitness structure and someone doing yoga. I'm now-- Wow. Okay.

11:38

So, all the properties are really linking on to this aspect of saying, "Yes, we have these beautiful rooms. Yes, we have these beautiful this, this, this, this, this." But suddenly using photos of good-looking people doing yoga poses, suddenly you are seeing pictures of salads, and not big steaks and chips and wine. So really, there's a shift nationally in this country.

I won't speak about other countries because it is happening there as well. Towards wholesomeness, towards being healthier in your nutrition, the relaxation, I think, just comes into it. Because you're going to another place and you're discovering as well. But really, there is a very big shift towards people thinking about their wellbeing, how to be healthier. Because where this really came in, is the [sysco 12:28] who, couldn't stop talking about your immune system, about being healthy about protecting yourself. And the statistics we saw internationally where, the unhealthy overweight, people with problems were the ones who really, really suffered and unfortunately, some of them passed away during COVID. So, we all suddenly went, "Okay, we need this super boost. We need this magic pool; we need to all be healthy." Which is fantastic for wellness, and great for our industry. And we're going to have a much healthier, active wellbeing population around the world.

Kerry Newsome: 13:06

I guess the thing I want to just make sure that we're on the same page with, is there going to be more retreats? Is there going to be more- I guess- I don't want to use the word serious. But I mean, in depth, mindfulness around this, that's probably what I want to get to in Vietnam. With all great intentions. I think sometimes the Vietnamese can kind of skip those processes a little bit.

Hylton Lipkin: 13:36

Very good point. Excellent point. And, yes, the quick fix is obviously the easy way. And from a smaller property perspective, from a smaller tour operator perspective, yes, just throw in a little picture on the webpage with a yoga person, we've got it moving on, and everything else remains exactly the same. So, there is definitely a degree to that. For sure. It's the cheap, easy way to say, "We've got everything that we had before. But now we also have this." So just to attract those 10 or 20 different extra people to come into the country because we've got that box ticked up. But going deeper, as you said, yes, I think in the past, Vietnam was very much based on culture. The main aspect of visitation to the country was culture and beauty. Whereas now with this wellness, there are companies, and more and more people like in Luminary Wellness for example, who are going deeper and from the development stage, there is a wellness concept being incorporated. In fact, to the point where now they are architectural companies, who are incorporating, the wellbeing design and this is becoming very popular.

14:14

Again, Return on Investment. It's easy for us to speak I'm very passionate about it. But when someone's pouring in hundreds of millions of dollars, and I'm telling him, that he has to make his windows, and they need to open and there needs to be fresh air, and he's like, "Well, how much does the small window cost? And how much does the double ply blah, blah, blah, blah, window cost?" or the whatever.

There's that game that still has to be played. But to answer your question, yes, before we used to talk about these big wellness centuries, in the States, or in Thailand, very popular as well, and obviously up in Europe, in the mountains, in the Alps, and things like that, but Vietnam was never on that list. But now it is. Now we definitely have-- personally, I don't want to blow my horn and say that my property is one of those, that definitely we consider ourselves as one of the more integrated wellness destinations in Vietnam. And we're not alone. And you mentioned Michelle Ford, I know she's working on an integrated wellness destination, not far from us. And there are more and more. So, to answer your question, yes, there's definitely more of an in-depth wellness destination, coming in Vietnam without a doubt.

Kerry Newsome: 16:10

That's comforting to hear, because, that philosophy of wellness, mindfulness and travel, in this space, there's so many expectations to meet, I'm talking to travelers, and they're the ones that drill down and just want to get down to, you know, really what there is. And as we know, Vietnam does offer a diversity of beauty. I mean, I just- I can go to Hội An and, the first day, I feel lifted just because of the color, because of the vibe, the energy, the lanterns, twilight, so I can get a sense of wellness, just through their culture. But to go to the lengths that you're talking about, which I think is great. And, I know your property, and I want you to talk about your property, because I think it's a rich example. And certainly, the direction I want to take with these podcasts is to be able to offer my travelers, different options that are real, that you know, are told from the perspective of knowledge. And because you have that background, that's a real gift. Not every general manager of one of these locations would have your wellness background. So, to me, that's a gold star, automatically. So maybe talk to us a little bit about Alba, and maybe a little bit about Huế, so people can get the combination of what they can experience at the Alba Wellness location.

Hylton Lipkin: 17:52

Okay, so now it's my five minutes of pitching advertising.

Kerry Newsome: 17:57

No, no, I don't want your pitching advertising, no.

Hylton Lipkin: 18:02

This is the story. There's only one place in Vietnam that you need to visit. No, okay, I'm joking. [laughter] In central Vietnam, where we are in Huế, I think, I'll do it the other way around, I'll explain a little bit about Huế then go into Alba.

Huế is actually the imperial capital- was the imperial capital of Vietnam. So again, I had no idea about this. I knew about the north and the south, I knew about the Americans being involved, I think we got some of that from Hollywood, basically, and a little bit in history if we delve, but beyond that, not much. And I found myself in Huế, which actually has this beautiful Citadel, a very big palace, which was the home of the emperor of Vietnam for many years. And they have really kept it as best as they can. So, it's a fantastic historical relic that you find in the center of Vietnam and everything around that is centered towards the Citadel. So, when you actually come into Hue, you find this place and it's really a wow moment. It's- "What is this?" Just is like the first time you see Buckingham Palace or something, you know, wow!

19:12

So that that's really something different and something unique for this area. And then the city itself is very beautiful with the water landscapes, and actually people live inside the Citadel, they have housing all around inside, so you just have these big castle walls. So, it's actually very unique and very pretty.

Then ourselves. Alba is actually about 30 kilometers out of the city. The reason we are there is there's hot springs that come out of the ground. So about 40 years ago, these hot springs were discovered actually, over 100 years ago, these hot springs were discovered. And then over time, certain people got involved again, I won't go into details about who found Alba, but Madame Chào, she bought or rented this area and said, "I will develop these hot springs for the people." So, there's a very big CSR concept behind it, where she wanted the local people to be able to use the benefits, and the medical benefits of these natural hot springs, and not be closed off into one of those international very expensive types of areas. So, which is a great idea.

20:22

So, our whole property was built around that. So today, what we have is what we call Alba Wellness Valley, which is built up into two properties, we have one side, which we call Thanh Tan, which is where the hot springs are, and people can come for a day pass. And there is camping and there is highlands and zip lining and hiking and swimming activities and many, many different activities. But the local people can come for one day, it's not expensive. And they can enjoy the benefits of the hot springs and the whole environment of being outside. On the other side, we have what we call Alba Wellness, which is more of a high-end, four-star, five-star property, which also incorporates the hot springs and everything with it, but it's more on a higher end. So, we really get the best of both worlds. So, we are using the hot springs as a central attraction. But we are allowing the high-end population more on a more expensive- if we could say that, to benefit from that with more intense and more developed programs, that you mentioned earlier. On the other side, we have the very down to earth, just come sit and soak in the hot springs, take it in, and it doesn't cost you almost anything. So, we really tried to maintain the concept of the founder, Madam Chào, where it remains affordable for the local people.

21:45

On the wellness side we have-- the company that-- we are managed by Fusion, has its own exclusive Wellness Spa concept. So, every guest gets a treatment included in the room, right? So, for example, anywhere you go in the world, most of the places in the world, you get Bed and Breakfast, which is kind of a given today. So, if you come to one of our properties, you get Bed Breakfast and Spa. So with every night stay, you have a treatment, depending on the category of the room, you can have a more intensive treatment, a longer treatment, you can upgrade and change things that-- everyone gets-- So if you come to Alba wellness Valley, you get a room, you get a spa treatment, you get breakfast, you get unlimited hot spring, you get all the wellness activities:

· Meditation.

· Yoga.

· Walking.

· Mindfulness.

· Hiking.

· Cycling.

There's many, I won't go into detail now, that's all included in the room. So, when we are talking about a wellness destination, when we are talking about people coming to a place for wellness getaway, it's ideal. Again, I don't want to oversell myself and say we're the best.

Kerry Newsome: 22:54

No, no.

Hylton Lipkin: 22:55

But we do offer everything that a person needs. Or wants in terms of: "Okay, this is how I'm going to change. This is how I'm going to relax. This is how I'm going to benefit my health. This is how I'm going to do this, or whatever it is." But just for the record, we do have that expensive bottle of wine if you do want it. It's not hanging on the wall in front of you. But it's definitely there. My F&B manager was very upset with me the other day, I cleared the bar area, we had a lot of alcohol up at the bar. And I put some very nice decoration up and I told him that people want alcohol they can offer it; he wasn't happy with me. But again, the idea is to have people really not-- it's like someone who's addicted to cigarettes, and you want to stop, you're not going to put cigarettes in front of their face every day. If they want to smoke, they have to go and find it or they have to go and buy it. So, there will be a reduction. So, I'm not telling I don't want the whole world to become healthy. And I don't want everyone to come to our property and go, "Oh my God, I'm just going to eat salad for three days and they're going to make me run up the mountain and there's not going to be a holiday." There is everything available.

Kerry Newsome: 24:01

That's the sweet point with Alba, is, it's available to you if you wish to take it up, but as you say, maybe not, you know, put in your face but sometimes, and I'll know- a group of girls, who say, "We should go on a retreat or something.: And then one of the girls will say, "I'm not going to go on a retreat and spend a fortune and drink tea for three days." So, if we can look at a destination like Alba to have the opportunity to expand on your wellness stay, if you want it, or mix it up if you want it. I think that's the sweet point

Hylton Lipkin: 24:50

I think it's very important as you mentioned, when you are building up a wellness destination or when you are building up something in terms of wellness. If you go too hardcore, you're going to scare off people. So, you want to be able to cater to everyone. So, your listeners would still want to come to Vietnam, they would still like to enjoy the beautiful colors of Hội An. Or go and eat street food in, in everywhere in the country. And yes, come back and enjoy yoga and everything. So, there must be the best of both worlds, they are destinations out there, where you go in, you close the door. And for five days you are drinking tea, like you said, and paying quite a lot of money for that. But there's an objective there. So really, in terms of wellness internationally, but today we're talking about Vietnam, the salad and the massage is actually a great step in to give you the idea of: "You can do it like this. But you don't have to do it like that", because we don't want to turn off people and make it too hardcore. And that's very important.

Kerry Newsome: 25:49

I think also that there is an interest within travelers to put sustainable travel with wellness. So, I'd like to talk to you a little bit about some of the sustainability practices that Alba offers, because, you know, people are somehow combining those, they want the combination, they want to be able to go into that location, knowing that the philosophy of that organization or that hotel in their practices, has got sustainability into the environment. And because I know you have a very great passion in environmental wellness, maybe you can speak to us a little bit about that, and how that shapes up with Alba and generally in Vietnam.

Hylton Lipkin: 26:46

Right, you're hitting all my passionate topics. As I mentioned earlier, wellness is a different thing to different people. And there's many different facets and different areas that wellness can be considered. What I'm working on at the moment is what I call Green Wellness. And green wellness actually breaks down into the physical and mental and wellbeing like you mentioned, there's also the social-economic impact. And then there's the environmental impact. So, I like to look at those three elements in terms of what we call green wellness. So, we've discussed a little bit about the environment, or the mindfulness and physical and mental. We spoke a little bit about the community. But in terms of sustainability, again, a massive topic. Again, COVID came in, and the first thing we saw worldwide was the beautiful canals of Venice that we blew, the whole world saw that and everyone- "I hear they played with the photos. That's not true." But that was a wakening up call. Because suddenly, we saw Venice with blue canals that no one had ever even heard of. Why? Because we're not on the boats.

27:57

Suddenly, the CO2 emissions in the sky completely dropped. Why? Because we're not flying because the factories are closed. So, it was definitely an awakening for us in terms of, "It can be done." So, there is a big shift, thanks to COVID in terms of: We need to protect our environment, we need to leave something there for our children or our grandchildren, because things are getting pretty bad. I mean, it's very sad that the last Co-Op meeting, the chairman started crying and said, "I'm sorry, guys, we don't have a solution." That is out of control. I mean, how can we allow that to happen? Where money in our pocket is more important than forest growing outside. So, I think you understand my passion and that I just don't understand why and how. So again, for Alba Wellness Valley, it's an important part of our existence of our DNA. We started off the year 2022. We planted 2000 trees, boom! it was freezing cold, it was raining. But we planted 2000 trees, we actually got the local community to come in and help us, so we got the local community, CSR involved, social, environment, people, and then obviously our team. So, if created a great environmental wellness concept of: "Hey, we need to wake up and we need to do something."

29:22

I'm working with some international groups at the moment, think tanks, very exciting. And we are coming up with different ways of how we can incorporate sustainability into hospitality, which is a very big topic at the moment. And the plastic bottles in a room. --I've just written an article that I hope to publish, that, some of these 1000 room properties in Las Vegas or wherever it may be in the world, even in China, have two plastic bottles in the room. Every day they run 80% occupancy, do the math, it's hundreds and 1000s of plastic bottles per month, times 12 per year, that are just one-use plastic. So, again, there's a shift towards having sustainable glass bottles in the rooms, the days of the little plastic bottles in the showers. I know it's not good for the companies that used to make those or still do make those. But that's just not sustainable. Why can't we have a one big plastic container with small ceramics, fill them up and reuse, reuse, reuse?

30:35

The RRR concept, reduce, reuse and recycle. And that's where it's got to be in water management, waste management, energy management, all of these things. So earlier, we mentioned that the investment and the development of the property, these things need to be considered at that time. Now, as general managers or hotel operators, we are doing everything we can to convert ourselves to be in a more sustainable situation. But if in the beginning, we said, "Hey, we're not going to use the grid electricity, we're going to invest an extra $100,000. But we're going to use solar, are we going to do this." Yes, it's going to cost more in the beginning. But generally, there's a budget in the beginning, there's an investment budget, so throw that in, then, and then electricity bills will come down. But from a marketing perspective, if you go out today, and you say we are off the grid, and we're using solar energy, you actually get more awareness towards your property, forget about the fact that you're saving money and you're saving the Earth, there's a massive- what's the word, not marketing, as far as I could say, marketing element to it.

31:42

So, sustainability is actually fashionable. And that's great. You don't need to wear Nike or Adidas, if you wear a t-shirt that says, "I care about the Earth", you'll probably sell it, maybe you get Kanye West to sign it for you, and you can sell it for $90. Give him $10 and give $80 to some association somewhere that can help the world. So, all of these small little elements, every property- and again, it's not just hospitality, it's the government. And getting back to the Huế government, I actually worked quite closely with the Huế Tourism Board, on other projects, Huế run this weekend as well, and Huế wants to be greener. And they are working on these pillars, where people will come to Huế, because of the green destination, because they are careful about the waste, because they care about the environment because they are planting trees. And again, it attracts people. So, from a tourism perspective, it's an attraction point. It's a selling point. But hey, that's a great thing. 10 out of 10, but at the same time, our grandchildren will have a forest in a 100 years’ time. So hey, we need to go with it.

Kerry Newsome: 33:03

I want to ask you, just as we finish up, because this was something that sounded rather interesting, when we began talking a week or so ago, you said, you are the ambassador of a Wellness Weekend. So maybe talk to us a little bit about that, as I'm sure my listeners would be interested to know.

Hylton Lipkin: 33:25

Okay, definitely. So, we have an organization called World Wellness Weekend, WWW. And it doesn't mean World Wellness Web. It means World Wellness Weekend. But of course, we link to the idea. The idea behind World Wellness Weekend is that, every year on one weekend in the year, it will be the 16th, 17th and 18th of September this year, the whole world comes together to do wellness activities. And when I mean the whole world, last year, we had 133 countries involved. We had a couple of 1000; I think nearly two and a half 1000 events throughout the whole world doing wellness activities on that weekend. Yeah, it's pretty exciting. And I'm honored to be a part of it. And again, I think you can understand a little bit about my passion and to make change and to bring people involved and have fun at the same time. I'm a there. Where do I sign.

34:24

So, I am the ambassador for World Wellness Weekend Vietnam. Last year, we had about 87 different events or people involved, groups. We were the 10th best country in in the world or our first year. Just for the record, South America is definitely the most active, Brazil- and they have so much gone on. But it's all about getting people to get out and do something, be healthy, be happy. Everything I mentioned to you in terms of green wellness is exactly what falls under. So, if you get 200 people and you go out into a forest, and you part of the Huế government, and you all go and plant trees, that's part of World Wellness Weekend. If you take a bank or three banks, the corporate group and you go out into the parking lot, and you do a Zumba class on that weekend, that is wellness for the team, it is well as for the world. And it's another activity. If you are a resort or wellness destination like ours, and you're organized something and you bring 100 people together, and you all run through the forest, or you plant some trees, or you do pushups or you carry logs around or whatever it might be. That's another wellness activity.

35:43

So, our objective as ambassadors for World wellness weekend is we try to find people like yourself who can promote it and get more and more people involved. We have a webpage, world-wellness-weekend.org. And on that, there is what we call the wellness map. So, you can go on and you can sign up, Kerry Newsome, I live in Australia, I do XYZ in this place, I go to this fitness center. And on this weekend, my friends, and now we're going to do this. And then that is tabulated and counted throughout the whole world. And then we know that Kerry Newsome in Australia is going to be doing this on that weekend. And we have to do press releases, throughout the whole world. So just because ABC is spinning center in Brazil, he is doing a spinning class, the whole world, the people in Huế in Australia, in Russia, in Helsinki will know about it. So, we really come together as a family about wellness, promoting wellness, and we have a hashtag, two hashtags, which is called #WellnessForAll and #WellnessByAll. And those are the hashtags we use. So, I don't want to too much at [crosstalk]. But please go on Facebook and just talk world wellness weekend you will find France, Germany, India, Vietnam, they are all there, follow us, go to our webpage. And most of all, go to your gym or your yoga center, or your friends and say, "Hey, let's sign up. And let's do something on the 16th, 17th and 18th, or one of those days, all of those days of this year." And join us [crosstalk]

Kerry Newsome: 37:26

I might even see myself in Vietnam at that time. So, you know, crossed fingers, I can maybe join you at Alba.

Hylton Lipkin: 37:42

I think as we've mentioned throughout this whole call, there's definitely a big development and a big growth in terms of wellness. So many of the properties that you do already know or to do advertise have a wellness influence that is coming in, definitely. They are more and more destinations, Thuận An. There are one or two properties in Thuận An, that are very wellness orientated. You mentioned Hội An. There are actually one or two in Hội an as well and obviously us. But that only covers central Vietnam. So, I would say in central Vietnam- I wouldn't say, we are leading the way, but there's definitely development in terms of wellness destination. But going out into the different parts of the country, there are things everywhere. Like we mentioned, investors now are more interested in the wellness concept to sell their properties, they see more of a return on investment. So, there will be a push in that.

38:44

Again, I don't want to do too much advertising because it's not the concept of the podcast. But the group that we work with, all that I work for, is Fusion Resorts. And we call ourselves the wellness hospitality company. So, every one of our properties, which is actually now in Thailand as well. We do CSR, we do community services, we do wellness activities, there's all spa inclusive as well. So, we have properties throughout the country. And all of those do offer wellness elements, maybe not as in depth as we're doing at Alba. But they do have that, but saying that I know that Starwood, I know that [inaudible 39:25], I know that Marriott- okay, Marriott and Starwood are the same company now. I worked with some of the people on some of the think tanks, and everyone is developing wellness concepts. Everyone is developing wellness packages. Everyone is developing retreats. So, I would say, just do your homework, go into the internet, but there's a lot out there, a lot.

Kerry Newsome: 39:51

Fantastic. I just want to say again, thank you very much for your time. It's been great to chat about this and I feel really good that we've got some depth going in Vietnam now and I can see a lot of tourists seeking out these places in the future. So, thanks very much again Hylton.

Hylton Lipkin: 40:11

No, thank you.